2 Minutes a Day, Twice a Day for Peak Performance with Brother Craig Marshall

At the end of your journey — when you ask yourself if your life had meaning — what do you believe the answer will be? Brother Craig Marshall joins the show to speak on the power of meditation and mindfulness to help you find the lifestyle you seek.

 

Tune in for an incredibly insightful conversation with a man who spent 35 years as a yoga monk, and the one-man David Poole calls his pocket Yoda. Get ready to take notes, but most of all, enjoy!

 

“The way we do anything is the way we do everything. Wherever we go, we’re taking our little mindset with us, right? So meditation to me is an opportunity to reboot my consciousness, to go back to my core and really start coming from the deepest place inside myself.”

— Brother Craig Marshall

 

Listen to This Is NuCalm on Apple & Spotify!

 

Craig Marshall was a yoga monk for 35 years and has educated/mentored tens of thousands of people on “mindfulness.” Craig is an author, speaker, and coach. His unique experience addresses workplace challenges that include stress, overwhelm, communications, turnover, employee engagement & work-life-balance – ultimately enhancing the customer/member experience.

You can find out more about Craig Marshall on MindfulU

 



Key Takeaways

[1:00] David shares how he met today’s guest, Brother Craig, and invites him to share a little bit about his life experience and what led him to commit to a life of service after college, and how he found Yoga and Monkship.

 

[6:30] Brother Craig shares the moment he was called to service and the very rich experience that followed, even through the doubts!

 

[9:00] Unlearning may be the key, Brother Craig speaks to all of the classical meditation techniques that enabled this as well as the advances that NuCalm offers.

 

[11:35] Mastering meditation may seem elusive but giving it an honest try may well improve many more aspects of your life than you thought. Brother Craig offers practical tools and offers a two-minute guided meditation.

 

[22:08] Brother Craig shares when and how long you should meditate to get the greatest benefits from your practice, from meeting the right people to receiving the best opportunities.

 

[25:10] Fun and Easy… The lifestyle you want, where you are happy, relaxed, and open is within reach.

 

[27:26] Meditation and mindfulness are hugely different and Brother Craig explains the seven mindful living habits of the conscious professional.

  • Awareness
  • Purpose
  • Leadership
  • Community
  • Creativity
  • Change
  • Communication skills

 

[30:12] David is moving into his midlife and asks Brother Craig to touch on the phenomenon of change and transition — what he calls the mid-life course correction touches on some deeply existential questions.

 

[33:55] The program for finding peace, love, and joy: combining NuCalm technology and MindfulU methodology!

 

[42:04] Q&A with the audience starts with Q1: What have the spiritual effects of COVID-19 been?

 

[45:39] Q2: For those of us looking to start a meditation practice, how do we begin?

 

[49:59] Q3: How do you use NuCalm, Brother Craig?

 

[54:26] Q4: A question from Brother Craig to David! What are the cumulative effects of NuCalm?

 

[55:23] Q5: Has Brother Craig’s time in the monastery helped him become more insightful or has he always been that way?

 

[1:00:26] Q6: Where does Brother Craig find inspiration today?

 

[1:04:13] Q7: Recommendations on how to use NuCalm?

 

[1:05:15] Q8: Would Brother Craig be averse to sharing some of Steve Jobs’ end-of-life insights?

 

[1:10:03] David thanks his good friend Brother Craig and signs off until the next episode.

 

Continue on your journey and until next time, breathe deep, relax and keep looking forward.

 

Mentioned in this episode

Self-Realization Fellowship

MindfulU

Eckhart Tolle

Simon Sinek

Paramhansa Yogananda

The Hero’s Journey

 

Books:

Future Shock, by Alvin Toffler

Conversations with God: An Uncommon Dialogue, Book 1, by Neale Donald Walsch

This is NuCalm, the show for those looking to improve sleep quality, manage stress, and boost recovery. Brought to you by Solace Lifesciences, the makers of NuCalm, the world’s only patented and proven neuroscience technology that works within minutes, without drugs, every time! In over one million medical sessions, NuCalm has helped men and women around the world.

NuCalm: stress relief for the way we live today, technology to help you disconnect.


Full Transcript

David Poole
My brother and I met Brother Craig in February, 2016, and we became instant friends. It was one of those karmic moments where you just connect to someone and it’s really easy. We tried to adopt him, but he rejected our advances. And in lieu of that we’ve become great friends. And Brother Craig to me is a touch down in a storm type of guy. I don’t know if people call him to find out how he’s doing, but I know when I’m in stress, crisis, have problems, metaphysical spiritual, overwhelmed with life, I usually flip out and then Jim calls like, “Dude, you’ve got to call Brother Craig.”

David Poole
For me having Brother Craig as a friend is like having a mini Yoda in your pocket. Right, Brother Craig, let’s get started by … just give us a brief history of your childhood and what led you to committing to a life of service right after college?

Brother Craig Marshall
Well, you make me sound so good David, but when I was a freshman in college, I took a course in economics 101 and I remember it so vividly. There was a definition in the text book of the word economics, right? And it was on the left side of the page in italics, in this preface and it said, “Economics is the study of man’s attempt to satisfy unlimited desires with limited means.” And I thought, Crap, it’s impossible by definition. This whole thing of seeking happiness, playing the game as most people play it. It was like I saw through the game a little bit earlier than most people I think. And I grew up in Los Angeles in a suburban area. My family was very nice, my parents were childhood sweethearts from Kentucky. And so I had a very grounded experience, and grew up in little league baseball and the Scouts. And all those things with suburban America at that point in time.

Brother Craig Marshall
But I think I somehow had some suspicions about living happily ever after. And when I was about 10 years old, I happened to stumble into the movie business through a friend. And so I started doing bit parts and started getting more parts and I was in probably, several hundred commercials and television programs during that day. So I grew up around adults and celebrities. So that gave me a view of life that I saw, even these people that look so glam and are so creative and so dynamic, I saw how neurotic they were. And again, it was like, What’s going on here?

Brother Craig Marshall
And so I was always looking for something a little bit more. And during my acting years, I actually ran into three people that influenced my life in major ways. So that’s how I got under this concept of coaching or mentorship, or like this, having a master mind group. And the first person was Ronald Regan. I met him when I was 13 years old. He was the president of the screen actor’s guild and he took me under his wing. I got to meet him and his family and he met my family. And then the second one was the actress Shirley Temple. We did some live television shows together and she became a kind of a surrogate mom. And the last one was Donna Reid, who you remember from that wonderful Jimmy Stuart movie, It’s A Wonderful Life.

Brother Craig Marshall
And she had her own show, and I was on that show. And so these kinds of people really changed the direction of my life. And I saw that they were happy, they were squared away. I really admired them instinctively. And I went through the hippy times and was looking for truth in a lot of crazy places. And this was Vietnam time so I was in the military during that war. So I’ve had a lot of different lives in this life. And I’ve had to transition a lot. But when I graduated from USE Film School, my life made a radical left turn and I got interested in yoga. I read the book Autobiography of a Yogi, which is kind of a classic. And I started meditating and within a year I signed up to be a monk.

Brother Craig Marshall
And in that framework I also had a mentor who changed my life in the most profound way. So I was always looking for, I think, three things. Peace was number one, love was number two and joy was probably the highest. So I think we’re all in that same boat. We’re just having different strategic conversations about how we can achieve those. And so that’s why NuCalm appealed to me when I first met you guys and tried your product. It was like, wow, this is a difference maker. This works. I wasn’t interested in number one, intellectual discussions or philosophical discussions. I wanted something that worked. So that’s my story and I’m sticking to it.

David Poole
It’s curious, makes me laugh a little bit like, “I went and signed up to be a monk.” So, what were your first experiences in the ashram like and how did you adjust to that new lifestyle? It’s radically different than where you came up.

Brother Craig Marshall
Yeah, that’s a typical question David, because it seems so strange to most people, but even in the Catholic church they have this word, vocation, which means calling. And I was actually called. It was like an intuitive experience. It was really weird, but in a meditation, I had this sudden light bulb going on experience. And I heard this voice say to me, “Just this once, don’t do what you want to do, but do what you know you should do.” And so that was very clear. And so I just followed that impulse. And when I went in, it was like it seemed natural to me. I was around really cool people. They were just like me. They were ordinary people, they weren’t wackos or they didn’t have their head in the sand. And we had a very busy life and the organization is called Self Realization Fellowship, it’s a very big non-denominational organization.

Brother Craig Marshall
And it’s all over the world. So I became a minister and a swami and was traveling the world teaching, and for 15 years I was in charge of training the youngest monks who came from all over the world. So it was a very rich experience. But we did meditate five times every day. We meditated in groups and we meditated individually. And I think all of that has served me in ways that I’m not even really aware of. Because I take it for granted.

Brother Craig Marshall
Like most people take work-holism for granted. Hey, that just the way it is. And when they’re driving home they stop at Happy Hour because they’re so miserable at work. And that’s just the norm for many people. But I never was part of that. So I always had sort of a balanced life, eating healthy food, a life of service and all that. But you know what David? Still I had doubts. Still I knew there were things missing in my life. And after 30 years, I went through a midlife course correction, and that spun me eventually out of the ashram after 35 years and I swear to God, I’ve learned more since I’ve left the ashram in the last 15 years than I learned when I was in the ashram, or at least it built on all of that.

Brother Craig Marshall
So, I still feel like a kid in school. I’m an old man, but yet I feel excited. I’m around only dynamic people. Cool people. No deadbeats and I just love being part of groups like you’re talking about with the Master Mind group where people are willing to really move into new chapters of their life. And I want to say one more thing and then would like to dialogue with you, but I read a book the year I became a monk. It was a very famous book at the time called Future Shock. Did you ever hear of that book or read that David?

David Poole
No.

Brother Craig Marshall
It was a very well known book at the time and it was written by a futurist named Alvin Toffler. And he was making all these predictions about what was going to be happening in the world in 50 years. Well, that’s this year. 2020. And he was dead on. And he talked about things like over choice and he talked about … He said, “The biggest challenges we’re going to have to learn so much so fast, that we just really can’t process it.” And he said, “In the 21st century, the illiterate are not going to be those people who cannot read or write, but the people who cannot do three things. Learn, unlearn and relearn.”

Brother Craig Marshall
And I thought, Wow. And I started committing, a long time ago, to this process of unlearning. Because I realized, hey, my head is just programed. I was trained and grew up in another century. And so, we’re living in the 21st century. And it’s like how many of our beliefs are going to hold up? How many of our normalicies or things we call collectively, reality, are really real? Os is there an open system here?

Brother Craig Marshall
So, I have been committed to this unlearning to make space in my head for new ideas and new thoughts. Because with NuCalm, I was originally skeptical because in my training as a monk, we were trained to sit down and we had the methodology of breath work and visualizations and affirmations and chanting and prayer and study and all this classical stuff. So we were very much against drugs and gadgetry of all kinds.

Brother Craig Marshall
But when I tried NuCalm for the very first time, I thought, Wow. This works. This is like a jump start for me. It doesn’t take the place of meditation, but for people who struggle with meditation, and these days in our go-go period of life, it’s a challenge for most people to sit down and shut up. To turn off the bubble machine of the mind. But yet if we don’t do that, we can’t be creative, we’re going to be distracted, we’re going to be superficial and in many cases, we’re going to be part of the problem rather than the solution, if we can’t get that depth.

Brother Craig Marshall
So that’s why I’m such a fan of NuCalm.

David Poole
So, Brother Craig, can we talk for a minute about meditation and some of the virtues and values and how you mastered the art of meditation. Because it seems very elusive for most of us.

Brother Craig Marshall
I agree with you David, completely and I talk to so many people who when you mention meditation, they say, “Oh, yeah, yeah, I tried that. I can’t do that.” It’s just like they discount it completely. “No, my mind goes too fast.” And I think there’s a relationship with how we sleep and our relationships, our sense of self, our career success. All those are inter-related. Why? Because the way we do anything is the way we do everything. Because wherever we go, we’re taking our little mindset with us.

Brother Craig Marshall
So meditation to me is an opportunity to reboot my consciousness. To go back to my core and really start coming from the deepest place inside myself. You can call it your higher self, you can call it anything you want. Where my creativity is, where my inspiration is, where my intuition lies and get away from my ego and my just old school programming. And if I don’t do that, I’m going to be restless, superficial and shallow.

Brother Craig Marshall
And I just can’t be happy at that rate. So, what we in our program do is we teach many meditations. So we give them actually tools. And if you’d like, we can do it right now? Do you want to do a guided meditation for a couple of minutes? Or is that too scary David?

David Poole
No, no, no, that sounds amazing. I’m ready.

Brother Craig Marshall
Are you ready for the truth?

David Poole
Let’s do it.

Brother Craig Marshall
Can you handle the truth David Poole?

David Poole
Probably not, probably not. My head might explode, but I’ll try it.

Brother Craig Marshall
Okay. Let’s all do this together and we’ll see if David can handle this for two minutes. Okay? So here’s a very simple process, and I will talk you through some things. So you don’t have to be completely nulled out. So the first thing is the body. So, sit up straight, spine straight with your back away from the back of the chair.

Brother Craig Marshall
Close your eyes and focus them between and just above the eyebrows, but no strain. And the last thing with the body is to put the hands at the junction of the thighs and the abdomen with the palms upturned. This pushes the shoulders way back, which is enlarging your lung capacity.

Brother Craig Marshall
And then make a mental resolve not to move the body. So at this point we’ve pretty much overcome the body, and now we can start disciplining the mind. If you feel like scratching. Don’t. It’ll go away. No movement. Total silence, total stillness. Okay.

Brother Craig Marshall
So where do we go from here? Well, the yogis thousands of years ago discovered a very humbling thing. And that is that the mind oftentimes cannot control the mind. It’s like they say, “It has a mind of its own.” So how do we slow down, gear down and get into that deeper part of our consciousness? Because our mind is not the whole story. You can do all the neuroscience and learn all of that stuff, but your consciousness is bigger than your mind.

Brother Craig Marshall
How do we get into that deepest, most meaningful, most nurturing part of ourselves? Well, the yogis made a connection between the breath and the mind. So right now, with your eyes still closed, let’s take a couple of deep breaths together. Let’s inhale, exhale. Inhale, exhale. One more time. Inhale, exhale.

Brother Craig Marshall
Now check that your eyes are still uplifted. Put your attention at the nostrils and just watch the breath coming in and going out naturally. When it comes in you’ll feel it a little cooler, when it comes out, it’s a little warmer. But if a thought comes to you, a memory comes to you, just toss it out. No thoughts. Zero thoughts. Just watch the breath.

Brother Craig Marshall
Now keep your eyes closed and I’m going to explain to you what will happen next in this progression if you do this on your own. As you simply watch the breath with the spine straight, totally still body and the eyes uplifted, what will happen is the breath will slow down. The heart rate will slow down. Your thoughts will slow down. And in terms of the breath, if you watch it very carefully, here’s what you will observe.

Brother Craig Marshall
As the breath slows down naturally, there’s going to be a little gap between inhalation and exhalation and a little gap between exhalation and inhalation. And as the breath slows down, those gaps are going to enlarge. Watch it happen. It’ll happen every time. Those gaps. And in those gaps of non breathing, between breaths, that’s where you first start to feel this thing called peace. Which is the first manifestation of a deepening consciousness.

Brother Craig Marshall
It’ll happen naturally, you don’t have to analyze it. In fact if you do start thinking about it, it will go away and your breath rate will go up. But this whole process of slowing down will lead you naturally down a path that leads from peace to love, to joy, and that includes new ideas, a creative awareness, a more heroic sense of self. Fears go away. Doubts go away. All of this ego stuff. It just disappears naturally.

Brother Craig Marshall
And this is the value of concentration and meditation. And without it, my life would be a completely different life. And then it starts to leak into your conscious life. So, open your eyes now. And if you think about your normal every day life, it’s like what can you do. And we work with a lot of businesses and what we’re trying to do now, we’re on a little mini crusade David, to get people, all of our students and there’re several hundred right now, to have them meditate at their desk for two minutes every morning and every afternoon during the work day.

Brother Craig Marshall
And their first thought is, well what if people see me? And it’s like, well that’s part of the point. Let them see you. Because they’re crazy. They’re stressed, they’re ragged. Let them see you. Like a little Buddha there for two minutes. It’s just like a coffee break or something. And watch what happens. They’ll start to ask you about it. They’ll start to envy you. They’ll start to respect … Why, what do you do when you close your eyes? It’s like, how could we make this a corporate norm called sanity? A little detachment. You’re going to go back, you’re going to be more creative, you’re going to be more dynamic, you’re going to be more friendly, you’re going to be more engaged. You’re going to get more bright ideas. You’ll get guidance from within. And it all starts with just slowing down the breath.

Brother Craig Marshall
So what do you think about that intuitively David?

David Poole
That was amazing. I was trained to meditate during martial arts training and that was more about restraining my violent nature, temper and it never worked. Just made me more angry.

Brother Craig Marshall
Well, you know the truth is we all meditate in different ways. Like I know you, you go regularly for walks. So being outside is very meaningful to you. If we put you in a cage, you would just be like a tiger walking back and forth and back and back and back and forth. And you’d go crazy, wouldn’t you? So that’s very nurturing for you. And it’s like athletes get in the zone, or artists get in the zone, or musicians are in the zone. I mean it’s that state of almost what they call suspended animation. But doing it consciously, that’s really amplified stuff. So, it’s really to me, it’s a necessity for anybody who wants to be a peak performer.

Brother Craig Marshall
And I’ve counseled people. I was coaching Steve Jobs and he asked me about this many, many times because he first read this book that got me on my spiritual path. The same book the Autobiography of a Yogi. He read it when he was 19 years old. And he called up Self-Realization Fellowship and was asking permission to get that book on iTunes, which it is. In audio version. And I was talking to him right up till the last part of his life. And he was very, very interested in all of this because he was almost planning his life beyond death towards the end of his life. It was a really interesting conversation.

David Poole
So, Brother Craig, two minutes a day or two minutes twice a day, I mean, I felt really good. That was … I didn’t want it to end. It was very delicious for me. What’s a good timeframe if I want to just dial it back, achieve that moment of peace. Is a five minute goal okay?

Brother Craig Marshall
Oh yeah. That’s plenty in the beginning because the yogis talk about the most auspicious times of the day to meditate are sunrise, noon, sunset and midnight. And this is astrological and I don’t know details about that. But I think any time you do it. It’s like that old commercial for 7Up, and it said, “The pause that refreshes.” That’s what meditation is to me. But I get ideas, I get guidance through it. So it’s a course correction thing, it’s not just like a time out. And then you get into these things that we, for lack of a better word call, synchronicities.

Brother Craig Marshall
It’s like you guys and NuCalm, you know a lot about neuroscience, you’ve talked to a lot of people on your time and on your team and your board of advisors, but to me, neuroscience is like a fledgling science. I don’t think they know hardly anything about consciousness. Yeah, they can put electrodes on your brain and measure activity and certain parts of it. And they understand a little about the chemistry and a little about the electricity. But they don’t know anything about consciousness. They don’t know who we really are. They don’t understand our potential, which I think is unlimited.

Brother Craig Marshall
But these days, you hear in various modes of thought, things about synchronicities. And it’s like, I believe in that and it’s changed my life so much to become aware of that inner guidance. Like when I met you guys, it was like, bing. Like you said, it was like, these are my kind of people. I don’t know what it is, there was a resonance, some vibratory attunement, where we had certain common denominators or something. It was like something’s going to happen here.

Brother Craig Marshall
And it’s like you feel that about some people. With other people you feel some aversion. Ah, I don’t know whether I want to spend time with that person. It becomes almost black and white. You become really sensitive. And then you get guided to ideas. Then pretty soon things start coming to you. Opportunities, money, ideas.

Brother Craig Marshall
And it’s like life can be a lot easier than most people live it. Because I used to be a grinder. I was a typical man. Even when I was a monk because I was young. And I felt like a cowboy with two guns on my holster and one was my intelligence and the other was I’m going to line my ducks up, I’m going to establish my goals, I’m going to get my strategies in place. And I’m going to make things happen.

Brother Craig Marshall
But now, it’s like, I’m living a whole different lifestyle I would call it. And it really has changed everything and I swear to God, I’m still ambitious, I own a company, I know thousands of people, I travel the world. I’m much like you guys. But I’m not grinding anymore. It’s almost effortless. It’s fun. There’s a cool factor and it’s like … I was giving a lecture one time and this thought came to me. And I said, You know, I don’t have any tattoos, but I’m thinking about getting two. Two tattoos. And I’m going to put them, one on the forearm on my left by my watch, and I’m going to put the other one on my right forearm, and when anybody asks me to do anything, I’m going to fold my arms and look down like I’m in deep thought, but I’m going to be looking at these two tattoos.

Brother Craig Marshall
And they’re the criteria for me making any decision in life. And on the left I’m going to write the word, fun and on the right side, I’m going to write the word, easy. Fun and easy because I’m tired of climbing Jacob’s ladder. I’m tired of struggling. I’m tired of efforting my way through life. But that’s what I did for a long time because I was young. And that’s the way everybody played the game. It sounds passive to some people. What’s the ROI on that? Come on, man. It sounds flaky to me. It’s not.

Brother Craig Marshall
Because you know what it is? To me, a metaphor for that shift would be like a gear shift in a car. And when in an old fashioned stick-shift, when you move from one gear to another, two things happen. One is you go at a greater speed, but you go at a lower RPM. Doesn’t that sound cool? That’s a win-win. Isn’t it? And that’s the way I’m living my life. And out of that, I think I’ve drawn people like you into my life. I’ve drawn my wife into my life. And it’s a whole different chapter. I’m playing the game in a very, very different way.

Brother Craig Marshall
And I think it’s evolutionary I think more and more people are headed in this direction, because people are burning out. I don’t think the current lifestyle which people call, normal, is really sustainable. Maybe normal, but it’s not natural.

David Poole
Indeed. Hey, Brother Craig, can we talk about the difference between meditation and mindfulness? If there is in fact a difference.

Brother Craig Marshall
There’s a huge difference and if we would make a pie chart out of this David, I would think that meditation is only one slice of the pizza. And the other slices have to do with clarity, with work-life balance, with de stressing. And they’re all inter-related so it’s really hard to talk about them individually because they really overlap, but when my business partner, Rick Ladendorf and I put together our company Mindful [inaudible 00:27:08] some years ago, he was talking to me and he said, “Do you think that you can take all of the stuff that you’ve learned through your studies and put it together into a package?” And we did. And we came up with what we call 7 Mindful-Living Habits of a Conscious Professional.

Brother Craig Marshall
The first one is of course, awareness. Greater awareness. We all need to be more aware. We all need emotional intelligence or many, many different kinds of things that allow us to be more perceptive. The second thing is to align with purpose, with our life purpose. With the purpose of a project, with the purpose of the organization we work for, that’s how teams are built with all of that alignment. So purpose is number two. Then comes inspired leadership. There is a responsibility of guidance and so forth. Then comes culture and community. How do we work together, what are our shared values? What is the meaning, or are we at odds with each other?

Brother Craig Marshall
And even when I was a monk David, it was like it used to just really drive me up the wall, but many, many times the meaning took place after the meeting. We would have a committee meeting and that after that meeting people were whispering to each other and they’re really speaking in their truth and talking. But they didn’t voice that during the meeting. And I thought, what’s with this, it’s crazy. So there wasn’t that trust in a community.

Brother Craig Marshall
And then comes creativity and innovation. What’s the output? Is it really dynamic, are we just moving things around on the checker board, or we’re really moving the whole board? And then finally comes change and transition. And I think the world is completely in transition these days and that’s why there’s so much uncertainty. And finally is core communication skills. So all of this is in a package I would call mindfulness. It’s a lot. It’s a lot. It involves a lot of learning and a lot of unlearning.

Brother Craig Marshall
But that’s a long way of saying it, but it’s hard to pinpoint the word mindfulness.

David Poole
I appreciate that sounds very complex. Can we shift gears for a moment and me being 51 years old and the mid-life crisis that opportunity for me. Can you talk about the phenomenon of change and transition?

Brother Craig Marshall
Boy, you’re asking some good questions today David. Really, that’s a biggie. In my experience of coaching many thousands of people, so it’s not just my experience, most people in mid-life, and that can start earlier or later. In some people you have to be 50 before you start waking up and living own life instead of just playing the game and living the tribe’s life in your conditioned way.

Brother Craig Marshall
It’s really a shift from outside in because they say that the most oft question is, what will they think? We’re very conditioned to need approval from other people. And that’s a very tribal way of living. To fit in. Play the game. We all went through public school, we had to do certain things to get decent grades to pass. So we started off largely as conformists. But where that comes into doubt, is in middle age where there’s something that calls to us, or back to that word, vocation or call. And there’s something, you can call it our intuition or higher [inaudible 00:30:38] that’s asking you the question, hey, are you on track with your most meaningful goals? If the second half of your life is like the first half, are you going to be satisfied? What do you really want? Who are you really? These kind of existential questions come up.

Brother Craig Marshall
They used to call it a mid-life crisis, I call it a mid-life course correction. And I’ve been through it. And it lasted a long time. But I got a lot of help and now it’s like, if you believe in reincarnation it’s like I’m always in another lifetime now. I’m playing the game so different. My sense of self is so shifted and it’s like I couldn’t go back for all the tea in China, and do all that efforting and that fitting in, and that materialism that’s sort of low level on Maslow. It’s like almost survival. But at the top of his pyramid as you remember, it’s self-actualization. That’s the high ground.

Brother Craig Marshall
And in developmental psychology, they talk about these windows, because Maslow when he wrote that pyramid, the key to that whole theory of his, which most everybody subscribed to, he called it proprioception, which is a five dollar word for meaning that you have to get yourself squared away on the lower pyramid to go up to the next. And there are these developmental windows. And in the last chapter of your life, here’s the question that everybody’s going to be asking themselves according to psychology. Did my life have meaning, or am I going to die in despair because I didn’t do what I came to do?

Brother Craig Marshall
So to me, it’s like, man, I want to know what my personal life purpose is. This is not a moral issue, it’s not about right or wrong like conscience. No, this is just me. And I had this discussion with George Harrison, the Beatle. And I was pretty close to him in the last 10 years of his life. And at one time I was in Switzerland and I was there to give him a technique of meditation. And we were really talking turkey. And I said, “You know George, you and The Beatles and the Maharishi brought to the west, the word karma.”

Brother Craig Marshall
Nobody’s every heard that word. Now it’s a very common word, it’s a very functional word because it means every cause has an effect and every effect has a cause. Yeah. Hello. Responsibility. But I said, “I’ll bet you money the next sans script word that migrates to the west is dharma. D-H-A-R-M-A.” Have you ever heard that word David?

David Poole
Yeah. Two seconds ago from you.

Brother Craig Marshall
Okay. Well, the word dharma is completely personal and it can only be decided by you. It’s not what’s right and wrong for the masses and everybody, it’s what’s right for David. And you can only answer that question intuitively. So you have to get into the deepest part of yourself. And only you can answer questions about, what do I want to do with my life? Who am I really? And mid-life is a transition about sense of self.

Brother Craig Marshall
Because most transitions are about a loss of a job, a loss of a relationship, or in mid-life it’s about a loss of a sense of self. It’s like your inner child is dying, and the adult hasn’t quite been born. That adult doesn’t have that clarity, that sense of self, doesn’t have that mission, isn’t on the heroic journey yet. But until we have those answers, we’re just going to be banging around. We’re just going to be faking it. We’re just going to be pretending. And that’s why you see all these people that have all this money and all this outer success and everything, and then they get older and they’re almost haunted, they almost have to drink and take drugs because they subconsciously realize, in a big way I had my ladder leaning against the wrong wall.

Brother Craig Marshall
I don’t know. I think these are the questions that we all can ask ourselves, which inform us. It’s like, how far can a company go without a mission statement and a purpose statement?

David Poole
Last, and then we’ll open up for questions, how do we … and there’s 52 people on this call, how do we approach the three tenets you talked about at the very beginning of peace, love and joy. What’s the cheat sheet?

Brother Craig Marshall
Read the Bible and pray. It’s like, there’s so many things that we can do and so what Rick and I have done, because we’re pragmatists, is we’ve developed a program that takes people through these processes with bite sized things. Because we know everybody’s busy. They don’t have time to go back to school and get a Masters degree in mindfulness. So we created a program, and that’s what we’re going to work out with you and Jim, is how your people can first of all sample our program, and then participate in this. It’s an online thing just like we’re doing now. And we’ve run a lot of people through this program and we’ve tweaked it and it is like magic.

Brother Craig Marshall
One of our clients is a pretty powerful, but old school guy. And he’s a corporate leader. And he’s an ex Notre Dame football player, a huge guy, very much of a curmudgeon, and he said, “When I first met you guys, I thought, this is not for me. My team may be interested in this, but I ‘aint going to show up for this.” And he said, “Now …” he said, “I look forward to these meetings so much every week and you know why? It’s because now, after each of these weekly meetings, I go on to my board meeting.” And he said, “Those guys used to run me ragged and shake me down,” and he says, “Now I go in there, I am so cool. I am so calm.” And he said, “I actually feel like I’m the only adult in the room.” It’s been so empowering to him.

Brother Craig Marshall
So we want to share this because I think it’s a great add-on. Because you guys have a technology and we have a methodology, and putting those two together is I think a high level win-win. Because we’ve all read personal developmental books, we’ve all been to workshops, things like that and there’s a spoke of enthusiasm. OH this is the greatest, this is going to make the difference. I’m really going to plug this into my life. And then a month or two later, the book’s on the shelf and we’re back to norm.

Brother Craig Marshall
So Rick and I are very much allergic to that and so we have built in a system where you have a mindful buddy, you’re watching videos, you’re listening to audios. And they’re short, three, four minutes each. You’re taking surveys, you’re doing exercises, you’re sharing the information. There’s multi sensory, multi learning methodologies built into this. And it’s like this leads to lasting change. So peace, love and joy are not at the end of the rainbow, they’re not at the finish line, if we’re not peaceful during the process and we’re not enjoying the process, that’s old school. That’s old school.

Brother Craig Marshall
And that’s the difference between happiness and joy too. Happiness is conditional. I’ll be happy when I get the kids through college, I’ll be happy when I get the house paid off or get my health squared away. Most people live like that. But joy is not conditional. Joy has no cause. Joy is just a state of consciousness which you can flip on like turning a light switch on in the room. And that’s one of the things that we teach you in this meditation process too.

Brother Craig Marshall
It’s like a miracle. But it’s common sense. You could teach it to kids. In fact one of our clients, he called me up and he said … he’s a golf course superintendent. And he said, “You know, I missed the first two weeks of your class because I was on vacation with my team.” But he said, “My mindful buddy got me caught up,” and he says, “I never went to school. I don’t even speak good English. So I had to have my wife translate this.” But he says, “I want to tell you that this is the most powerful thing that I’ve every read in my whole life and my wife has asked me if our two kids can go through this program with me.”

Brother Craig Marshall
And I thought, wow, because they don’t teach this stuff in school. It’s unbelievable. They don’t teach us what we really need to live successful lives, both personally and professionally. What do they teach you about relationships? What do they teach you about communication? What do they teach you about aligning with your purpose? It’s like blah, blah, blah.

Brother Craig Marshall
So I think the answer is to go through a process where you get ongoing support. I think that’s what we all need, what we all want. I’m married for that reason. You’ve met my wife, she’s totally cool. We help each other every single day, be better people. But it’s not nagging, it’s not harassment. It’s not judgment, it’s not this crap that undermine relationships. It’s really support.

David Poole
Appreciate that.

Brother Craig Marshall
And we’ve developed a global network of mindful professionals. So it’s like that’s why we want to be around your people who are committed to what you’re doing because there’s an overlap in our databases of people, and those are the people I want to be around. In fact, my wife and I were on an excursion to Egypt last year. And here we are on this boat, cruising the Nile and I say to this guy … and he’s a really cool guy, he’s from Boston. And he’s worked for Comcast, he’s a senior vice-president, he’s an accomplished guy. Just retiring these days.

Brother Craig Marshall
And the subject of NuCalm came up. And I was mentioning it to him and he says, “Oh yeah, I have two of those New Coms. I’ve been to the Tony Robbins program and everything.” And it’s like, wow. And it’s like, how do you meet people, how does this work? There’re things we do not understand that personally I want to know because I’m tired of grinding. I’m tired of the material way. I just will not effort anymore.

Brother Craig Marshall
I want to be around cool people, and I define cool people as those people who are willing to learn and people who are willing to unlearn. So there’s an openness component. That’s the only people I want to deal with anymore David.

David Poole
Excellent. We’ve got a question from Carla. Can you give us your perspective on what’s happening today relative to the COVID-19 situation, of particular the spiritual aspect?

Brother Craig Marshall
Oh, great question Carla, I’m glad you brought that up because people talk about it as a crisis. I don’t frame it that way. And I think most of us, and I include myself in it sometimes too, but it’s like we’re walking down a road. We have an agenda, we have goals, we want to get certain things accomplished, and all of a sudden a big rock rolls into that road. And we just say, “Oh my God, we got to get a lever and get this rock off the road so we can continue going the same way.” But yet, Buddha said, “That which hinders your task, is your task.”

Brother Craig Marshall
So what that means to me is this thing has come into our lives, this rock in the road, and to me it’s like, Hey, it’s here for a reason. It’s not bad news. I don’t believe in the judgment. I don’t use the words good or bad anymore, they’ve lost their meaning for me. It’s just a thing. So it’s like, okay, it’s happened, so therefore what can I learn out of it? What can we learn collectively as a global society learn?

Brother Craig Marshall
And you watch, there’s going to be tremendous learning coming out of this. And in 20 years from that they’ll look back, it will change communication, it’ll change supply change, it’ll change people’s sense of self. It’ll grow greater collaboration. I can’t even begin to guess at what were going to learn. It’s just like during the depression, everybody says, “Oh this is the worst economic thing since the great depression.” And they capitalize those words, great depression. Well, my parents were married in 1931 or two. They were right in the middle of that great depression. It informed their lives for 10 years.

Brother Craig Marshall
Did it make them bitter? Did it destroy their relationship? No, it gave them character. They developed a strong work ethic. People bonded together. There was something in the old days you don’t hear about these days called, boarding houses. People couldn’t afford their own house, they had to be collaborative. They had to share. They shared the cooking, they shared everything. It was like a healthy thing. It’s like my parents went through a World War Two. My dad was gone in the Pacific for four years. Did it destroy their marriage? No. It gave them character. They call them the greatest generation.

Brother Craig Marshall
It’s like these things are not bad, they’re opportunities. So, what irons in this fire are for you to learn. I don’t know what your life lessons are. I’m getting a glimmer, I keep asking myself, what am I learning out of this? And to me that’s what everything in life is all about. And so yeah, we’ll get back, they talk about getting back to normal. But I hope we don’t go back to normal. I hope we go forward into something more natural rather than normal because I think our society was a little bit whacked out in many, many different ways. Attention spans are going down, people are alienated, there’s lots of unresolved issues.

Brother Craig Marshall
And so I think we have to come together and first of all on the personal level and then on the collective, figuring out how can we upgrade, how can we evolve? So, I’m committed to learning my lessons and I think if we frame it like that, then it’s like, hallelujah, this is what’s next. Amen.

David Poole
Thank you Brother Craig, that’s sound judgment, or lack of judgment I should say.

David Poole
We’ve got a question from Perry. I’m curious about your prescriptive meditative practice. For those of us trying to establish a meditation practice, how do we begin, what’s a good amount of time and time of day?

Brother Craig Marshall
Well, I think that this is very individualistic, but if you’re interested in meditation, there’s lots of apps that you can get that will give you a background in terms of a soothing mentality, and music and little alarms and things like that that set up a space for you. And having a regular environment is very helpful. To go to the same place in your house, to have a little quiet corner where you … that’s your little cozy place. And maybe start by journaling, because journaling is a very interesting right brain activity.

Brother Craig Marshall
And we teach this in our program as a mini module. To gear the mind down and get you into your right brain and get you into your feelings, which slows you down and deepens your thoughts. And then when you start meditating doing some breathing exercises, and there’s tons of breathing exercises. But we coach people through this and there’s so much literature out there on it.

Brother Craig Marshall
But if you’re interested in it, one of the things that I would encourage you to do is to make a commitment to make it fun. Where it’s not a duty, it’s not a struggle, it’s not a challenge, it’s sheer fun. Because if meditation isn’t fun, it’s just another should. It’s just another efforting thing on your list. Oh, I should lose 10 pounds, oh I should exercise more. Oh, I should be meditating. A lot of people approach it with that and it will undermine it from the get go.

Brother Craig Marshall
But when we really understand … It says in the Bible, it’s a beautiful phrase, that peace which surpatheth all understanding. Because when you start getting a taste of this peace, it’s not passive. It’s a knowing. You feel everything always was okay, everything is okay, even in the middle of the virus, everything always will be okay. Everything is actually perfect. But sometimes I don’t know it. But when you start feeling that, you realize that’s an intuitive truth.

Brother Craig Marshall
And I’m writing a book now called, The Contra Dictionary, and it’s several hundred words and I’m writing in old school definitions and intuitive, progressive new school definitions for keywords. And watch when this comes out. And we’re seating these words in our lessons that we share with people, and all of you are going to have an opportunity to participate in this program, and sample a couple of our lessons and get a taste of these things. But it really is about unlearning. Unlearning your view of yourself, unlearning your view of life and seeing a bigger picture. Going to higher ground. And it becomes a lot easier and it’s highly more productive in the outer world as well.

Brother Craig Marshall
And then, you guys almost have some incredible magnetism to draw to yourself like these guys Jim and David and be part of this NuCalm mastermind group. And that’s our goal, is to create a global network of mindful professionals. Can you imagine? To have a think tank. To be able to work with other people. You’re not on your own.

Brother Craig Marshall
In Self-realization Fellowship, the organization I was a monk with, we used to have annual con vocations. They still do, every summer. And there would be 7,000 people in one room. Or in an ancillary room in a big convention type hotel. And we would all meditate together. It was unbelievable, just to be in silence with 7,000 people. It’s so much energy that you can ride on it. But when you’re alone, it’s much harder. So group support is something.

Brother Craig Marshall
And these days, you could arrange online meditations. You could do affirmation things. You can do anything if you make it fun. People are hungry for this and they’re ready for this. The grinding, the struggle, it’s running out of gas.

David Poole
We got a question from Cara. Can you compare your experience with meditating verse NuCalm and do you use NuCalm sitting up, focusing on breath et cetera, or do you lay down?

Brother Craig Marshall
Good question. I have used NuCalm in a number of ways. But I don’t clinically, I have never charted how it works most effectively toward this or that outcome. But I would really encourage you to try those things and share that with the mastermind group, because I’d be really interested in all of your answers. So, I don’t know what questions all of you are going through and what you’re reporting and tracking is with your NuCalm experiences, but I’ll be very interested, and keep in touch with Jim and David about all of this because I think it’ll be very revealing and I would love to hear your motivation and try some of your suggestions too. And I’m committed to using NuCalm in new and different ways because I think it’s unlimited.

David Poole
So can you talk Brother Craig, for a moment about what is your habit. When do you use NuCalm and do you use it to stack your meditations, do you use it after meditation, before meditation?

Brother Craig Marshall
I used to be very regimented when I was a monk, there was a daily schedule. And I honored that. And so I really grooved my consciousness in these different ways. Now, I’m much more fluid and so to me NuCalm is sort of a as needed thing. And sometimes I say to myself if I get tired in the afternoon, I think, do I want to take a nap for half an hour, or use NuCalm? And the answer is always NuCalm. Because I’m going to come out of it, not only rested, but invigorated and energized in ways that I’m not even able to talk about. There aren’t words to describe it all.

Brother Craig Marshall
So I would say, you need to find your best way, but I think that using NuCalm in the morning to start your day is great. I know that a lot of people say that they don’t like using it late at night because it keeps them awake. I think we’re all a little bit different and our consciousness has a lot of flex and flow to it. So you have to figure out what works for you I think is the basic answer.

David Poole
And what about using it with meditation, like doing NuCalm kind of clear your head and then …

Brother Craig Marshall
In meditation, it starts with concentration of course before you can meditate, and meditation is fundamentally a process, a step by step way of going within. And we don’t even know what within means. But there are energy systems that are beyond our bodies that the yogis talk about that are energy reservoirs and they talk about chakras or spinal centers. There’s all this stuff that we don’t know about in the west.

Brother Craig Marshall
And so I have used NuCalm before meditation, after meditation in different application modes. And I think it’s a jump start for meditation. So generally I’ve used it before. Simply because after I meditate, I’m motivated then to get into taking my calm and my inspiration into the workplace where I’m ready to roll. But I think NuCalm is a great time out, a great … The young people talk about disruptive technologies, NuCalm is a disruptive way of interrupting my thoughts when my thoughts get negative or when my thoughts get limited, or I find myself in fear, or I just feel yucky in any way. Put on the NuCalm, bang!

Brother Craig Marshall
And just after the 20 minute power nap, you’re going to feel different, you’re going to think different, you’re going to be a different person for a while. And then it’s like going to the chiropractor and we sit hunched over our computer, our muscles are going to pull our spine into some irregularities. But NuCalm, I would say is both the preventative and a tool to use to get back to my core and my center.

David Poole
Be a better husband.

Brother Craig Marshall
And what about this David, tell me what are your all experiences with accumulative value of NuCalm? You know a lot of users who are using it in … some people more regular than others, what do people say about the build up of these positive attributes and outcomes?

David Poole
It’s funny, there’s a subtly to each NuCalm experience, but over time, there’s a C change, there’s a shift in your presentation of the world. I know that I’m more in control, more calm and much more energized. For me, I use it as a battery recharge.

Brother Craig Marshall
I think that’s a good way to put it.

David Poole
I don’t get depressed. I don’t take losses personally anymore.

Brother Craig Marshall
Wow.

David Poole
Which is-

Brother Craig Marshall
You’re a big boy now then?

David Poole
Yeah, no, I’m big boy.

Brother Craig Marshall
Wow.

David Poole
Just in time, right? Now, we’ve got a question from Dr. Allman, first she wants to thank you Brother Craig, thank you for your time, you have so much to offer. Do you think that it is your life experiences, particularly your time in the monastery that has helped you become so insightful and articulate, or have you always been a total nerd? Those are my words by the way.

Brother Craig Marshall
That’s an interesting question and I have no way to know because I have no control. We are the bi-product of the sum total of our life experiences, but if I hadn’t been a monk, I don’t think you’d want to have lunch with me. And for many years when I was a young man, I joked with people, but it wasn’t really a joke and I said that if I wrote my autobiography in the future, it would be called Two Wives and One Liver Later. I was too smart a rat. I could have never been happy playing the game of life. I saw through it at a fairly young age and I don’t think being a monk is the answer. It was my answer, it was what I needed obviously. It was my dharma, but yet I’m not a monk now. It’s not what I need at this point in my game.

Brother Craig Marshall
And so I would love to talk to you personally and ask you some questions about the chapters in your life because life does move in chapters. Young people don’t know this, older people do. But it’s like, when you’re a teenager it’s like you have a certain magnetism and that magnetism draws to you certain people, certain experiences and a certain sense of self, and hopefully you outgrow that. But most people, for whatever reason, plateau in life. They become same old, same old, they become predictable. Relationships can get stuck. And you can get stuck as an individual.

Brother Craig Marshall
And I think that’s what a mid-life course correction opportunity is all about, is to shake you up and say, is this really who you are and what you want? Because I’m so committed to moving forward, but it’s not straining really. And it’s not coming from dissatisfaction, but it’s coming from a knowing that there’s more to be had. I still feel like a kid. I’m an old guy and yet I hang around young people, I don’t like being around old people, even when I was a monk, I liked being around the younger guys because I related to that freshness, to that capacity to say, I’m a student. I don’t feel like a teacher. I’m not a preacher. I don’t need a pulpit because I’m always learning myself.

Brother Craig Marshall
And one of my great skills, which I think is native, is the capacity to ask questions. And I believe the three core communication skills are listening, questioning and story telling. And if you learn those three skills, and it doesn’t take a whole lot to learn them, it’ll transform your life. Just that alone. If you could teach your kids those three things, you would change the whole course of their life.

Brother Craig Marshall
But questioning is important to me because I think the answers that I come up with are only going to be as good as the questions I ask. Both myself or anybody else. And so, I’m into digging into these things and so maybe if I wouldn’t have been a monk and had been married a couple times and become an alcoholic and moved through that, maybe I’d be at the same point these days because of my sincerity. And really I think that’s my only personal claim to fame is that I’ve always been sincere.

Brother Craig Marshall
But I’m no longer a seeker, I’m more of an experience. I trust the process more. I didn’t before. Even when I was a monk. Even though I learned so much, I still was edgy, I still was restless, I still was sort of at war with myself inside, because I was young. And I think the only resolution to that comes from having a certain number of life experiences. And when I look back, I realize that I never trusted the process of life. Why? Because I didn’t understand the process. I really didn’t. Even though I had a Christian understanding and an Eastern understanding. I read Emerson and studied the Chinese and the old Jewish rabbis. Great information, fabulous. Behind me right here, you see there’s a little three by five quote cabinet, there’s probably two or three hundred thousand, three by five quote cards in there that I used when I was a minister and giving sermons.

Brother Craig Marshall
And I still go back to that stuff. I’m still adding to that stuff. I’m still a kid, I’m a life learner. But yet, I’m not a seeker. I’m not grinding. I don’t have somewhere to go. I’m satisfied with who I am, but yet I know there’s more to be had. So sorry for the long answer to your really good question.

David Poole
No, that was a great … Brother Craig, where do you find inspiration today? Who are the people that guide you or tickle your fancy?

Brother Craig Marshall
One book that I read that was break through for me, was the first in a series of books called, Conversations with God by Donald Neale Walsch, it’s pretty famous, it’s been translated into many different languages. I listened a lot to Eckhart Tolle back in the day. He made sense to me. These day I watch Simon Sinek who’s all about purpose and starting with why. That resonates with me.

Brother Craig Marshall
There’s so many people who are saying very similar things. And that’s what we’ve done in our lesson series, is we’ve cobbled together from all these sources and we have articles, we have bonus articles for people to read in every lesson that take you to the Harvard Business Review, that take you to really cool people who are onto cool things.

Brother Craig Marshall
But one of the people that influenced me of course, was my main teacher, the founder of Self Realization Fellowship, his name is Paramahansa Yogananda who lived most of his life in America and wrote this famous, classic book, Autobiography of a Yogi. But yet I’ve learned so much from so many people that I don’t have individual heroes at this point in time. I’m learning from almost anybody and everybody.

Brother Craig Marshall
I learn a lot from my wife on a daily basis. She is extremely committed to her journey. And that was the basis of our coming together. That was the magnet that drew us together was personal and professional development. We were a support system that prevented the status quo and from this plateauing in life. And she’d been through various chapters in her journey. But now, we get along famously and we are really co creators and we have dynamic life. We’re like kids. We have fun. We’re magnetic, we draw cool people to us.

Brother Craig Marshall
Last year we were having a Cinco de Mayo party and we were sitting down thinking about who to invite to this thing. And we realized as we started to just do it in a feeling moment … nah, I don’t know about that person. Oh this, person, oh yeah, for sure. And we came down to the central criteria for inviting people to this little party, was the quality of openness. Willing to learn and unlearn.

Brother Craig Marshall
And so everybody came to this party and the house was just packed with people and yet we were able to seat everybody in a circle that was there. And I said, “There’s some really cool people here tonight,” and I said, “But I’m the only one that knows every single one of you. You may know one or two people here, but nobody knows everybody except me. So I’d like to go around the room and introduce you to everybody.”

Brother Craig Marshall
So I spent about 40 minutes spending about three or four minutes on each person, defining their experiences, telling stories about them that made them so extraordinary. And at the end of this, the room just exploded like bees and everybody was going and talking to other people because they’d been set up in an environment where they all knew everybody in that room was special. Unique even. And they wanted to plug into that.

Brother Craig Marshall
And people keep asking, “When are we going to have another one of those? When are we going to have another one of those?” People are looking for their tribe these days. They want to be around like-minded people I think more than ever. So I think creating what you’re doing … We have a mastermind group, we have many mastermind groups actually, and people are loving it.

David Poole
Excellent. Thanks for not inviting me to that party by the way. Appreciate that. Just so you know Brother Craig, we’ve been purposefully ambiguous about how to use NuCalm because we want to be observers for the first three months of people’s use. But I want to honor everybody’s question, George asks the question, can you describe your NuCalm routine and regiment? I know that you said you’ve broken out of the routine format deliberately, but what would you recommend to George?

Brother Craig Marshall
George, I would just say try different things. Experiment. Pretend like you’re in a lab and you want to try this out, because it’s your experience that counts. And we’re all a little bit different. Sometimes we’re more receptive, sometimes we have unresolved issues going on. Sometimes we’re on different schedules, theirs bio-rhythms changing all the time. You figure it out. Don’t look for a protocol. You find out what works best for you and then share it with all of us. I’d be very interested in what you say.

David Poole
Excellent. I think we have got one last question. I appreciate all your time Brother Craig. This is from Perry. Sorry, I had one more question about something you mentioned earlier, I’m really curious about what you said about Steve Jobs spending his final moments creating his next life. Would it be inappropriate to share some insights from him? I understand if it’s too personal, he’s just someone I consider very inspirational in my life.

Brother Craig Marshall
Well, Steve was a very complex guy and he was-

David Poole
Did you like him?

Brother Craig Marshall
Well, he was a friend, so we were connected on a pretty deep level and had very meaningful conversations. And yet it was like with George Harrison, I only knew those guys in the last chapter of their lives. And I always thought that was for a reason. And it’s like all of us. I don’t think we would have needed to know each other as kids, but at this point in our lives we’re receptive. There’s a commonality here, there’s a common or cross over purpose for us all.

Brother Craig Marshall
So, with Steve, he was a seeker. And he had to go through certain things to get where he needed to be. And it was just like me, I needed to be a monk. That was part of my education and I needed to meet certain people and have certain issues to resolve you might say. And so when I met Steve he was very committed to his interior life. And it was similar with George Harrison, I always related them together a lot and I remember when George Harrison passed away and I was with him at that time, I gave two memorial services for him. One, in Los Angeles where his family and friends and another one at his home in England.

Brother Craig Marshall
And you could see the magnetism of these individuals by who they drew to them. And with George Harrison, when I gave the ceremony in Henley outside of London at his estate, it was in a little half built chapel. It was like it was built to be a ruin in this big 13 acre garden of his, it was just beautiful. And after the ceremony this man walked up to me and it was this famous race car driver, his name is Sir Jackie Stewart, he was a Formula 1 champion several years during the ’60s. And he said, “When you walked up there to give the ceremony …” and I’m wearing my ochre robe, he said, “I thought it was going to be more California hippie crap.” But he said, “I’ve seen many of my friends die in the racing business through the years,” and he says, “That was the most beautiful ceremony I’ve ever seen. And I want you to perform my memorial service when my time comes.”

Brother Craig Marshall
And I think as we get older, we all become like Steve and George. We boil things down to what really counts. But yet you have to go around the block. You have to go full circle in life. You have to be part of the problem before you can become part of the solution. And all I can say about Steve is, is that he did that. He did learn what he wanted to learn. He did become, in the last chapter, a person that he was comfortable with and proud of. And that was his legacy that I see. Even though I’m talking to you on my Apple computer and have an iPhone sitting by my side and all of that.

Brother Craig Marshall
We’re all on our own journeys and I think we only need heroes until we become heroes and then it’s a dharmic issue. Yeah, we get inspiration from these people, and we can pick up a lot of guidance along the way, but at a certain point, we have to turn that energy within and say, who am I? Why am I here? What flag do I want to fly? And go on our personal heroes journey.

Brother Craig Marshall
And that’s kind of scary. And not everybody does that. I don’t know how many of you have read Joseph Campbell, but his work about mythology and the heroes journey, most of the great movies of our time are based on Joseph Campbell’s map. And the hero goes through certain sequential steps in a circle, and at the first it’s outbound and like The Lord of the Rings, it’s totally about that. Star Wars, George Lucas consulted with Joseph Campbell, there’s even a movie of them on PBS talking about all this map. And we’re all on that same journey and you can see via that Joseph Campbell map pretty much where you are and what’s next. And that’s very helpful.

David Poole
Wow. You’re a badass Brother Craig.

Brother Craig Marshall
Well, I hang out with cool people like you guys.

David Poole
Listen, that’s all the questions, thank you very so much for your time tonight, your wisdom, your life.